Closed-Loop Electrolyser

[Farrah Day]

Bob

If you've read the old discussion between myself and AlaskaStar on OUPower forum, then you will probably note, as I did, that the guy has a bit of an ego to contend with - not unlike Mystic Murakami here.

He's clearly a clever guy with great aptitude, and when he puts his mind to something, then he seems to apply himself fully. However, contrary to what he led people to believe on the OUPower forum, he does not know it all and - like the rest of us - is not immune from making mistakes or indeed misinterpreting the science. What I found most difficult to cope with in our discourse was coping with his continual patronsing, 'holier-than-thou' attitude. He, like someone else I know, would never bow out gracefully if he was clearly and fundamentally wrong about something, but instead would argue the point forevermore in order to try and save face.

That said it was a couple of years ago, he might have matured somewhat since then.

Here's some reading you might find interesting Bob:

Alaska Star's Axial Flux Motor revolution

Index

Directory:ArcticTek:Chris Hunter (Alaska Star)'s Axial Flux Motor - PESWiki

You will note that on his web site that there is talk about high efficiency HHO being employed to boost engine efficiency, but not as far as I can tell be used as stand alone fuel. Which immediately provokes questions about the 1150 lpm of HHO at 5W figure being banded about (or more depending on which particular post you look at).

[iquant]

Farrah Day:

I noticed you elected to use glass instead of PVC in your replication efforts.
Glass will hold positive static electricity charges, PVC negative.
Maybe worth a try using PVC or CPVC per AlaskaStar's setup.

PVC begins breaking down at 80c... not sure what the process is but CL may be leached, released or catalyzing another reaction.

Regarding your sparking issue: This paragraph on Dielectric Breakdown maybe worth a quick read. Static

Food for thought.

[TheCell]

Thanks Farrah,

I had seen the website but not the Sterling report, Too bad it is from S Allen.

Chris's build looks to be very professional and the descriptions, mechanically speaking, accurate. I would hope that you are correct in the time / age factor.

I have uploaded the video and am awaiting processing....I'm sure I missed several things and am hoping fine people are going to point them out to me.

As of this test, the conclusion would be to stick with your current research and not to delve to far into this "direction"...at least not until I can correct the mistakes I'm sure I made and retest...


Hows the weather in the UK? as I'll be there WED....

YouTube - Chris Hunters project verification.


Thanks all,

Bob Potchen

[iquant]

Nice work Bob.

Please consider replacing the Pyrex container with the 1" PVC wrapped directly with 800 turns of copper. I suspect either CL catalyzing a secondary reaction or influence of the negative static charge from PVC.

[Gwandau]

Hi everybody,

I am fairly convinced there must be several paths to exite an electrolyte into dissociation
which are more accurately closing in on the key factors regarding molecular bindings than the
commonly used brute force of standard electrolysis.

Mankinds collected knowledge in the workings and causes of our basic forces are in a pitiful shape.

Not even Stephen Hawkings dare conclude any plausible theory why for example a magnet attracts a pice of iron,
or what an electron really is, so when we here at the "garage level" do a bit of creative theorizing,
it may just as well be right on the spot!

Farrah,
in my opinin you have a really interesting proposal to the chemical events behind a possible magnetolyzer.

The intriguing simplicity and genial suggestion that the sodium ions are able to collect an electron
in an electromagneticly exited surrounding somehow feels strangely familiar to me, like I have known
this before. (As a devotee to Robert Sheldrakes morfological worldview, I always take a deja vu like
this seriously.)

Your suggestion proposes indirectly the consideration of alterating field directions pulsed through
the caustic soup, which will be my main area of experiments this autumn.

Most of the experimenters in the OU-forum are locked onto pulsed DC currents through the coil surrounding the medium,
therefore I feel high frequency AC currents in the KHz to MHz range through the electrolyte would be both complementary
to the common research and interesting.

From my perspective everything has a harmonic identity, thus responding to certain frequencies relating
to the specific wave pattern of the molecule or atom in question.

Since I am convinced there is no such thing as solid matter, to me everything existing in universe is
expressions of unique standing wave patterns, interfering and relating to all other nodes in the harmonic
system uniquely, thus making every singel atom unique and dynamic.

I am convinced that we only need to find the correct frequency in relation to the atomic or molecular
harmonic values in order to make the ions resonate and thus open up for an electron exchange that will
enable the very chemical reaction depicted by Farrah.

Gwandau

[Farrah Day]

Nice to see some new names around here.

Bob, sadly your experiment bears out mine. That said we may well be doing something wrong or missing a vital piece of the puzzle.

You can see why I get so irritated by these claims though, when the originator either fails to replicate the device, fails to substantiate the claims and/or fails also to provide enough specifics for anyone else to replicate it.

One thing I would say is that your solution looked like a slurry. It looked over-saturated to me, and the suspended solids just may effect the process. Ideally the solution should remain fairly clear and water-like. At the point of saturation the water will not be able dissolve anymore lye, the solution will start to cloud and you will start to get particles in suspension.

The other thing playing on my mind is the current. Induction furnaces use very high current AC, as the higher the current the greater the flux density. I see you were using DC squarewaves. Why weren't you using AC sinewaves?

I would expect AC to work better than DC squarewaves (or DC pulses) for this, as you would be getting no reversing of currents as in the AC. Though the cations and anions will always be travelling in opposite directions with DC pulses, AC by it's very nature should be inducing a greater continual interaction.

Attached is a photo of my coil used for similar experiments. I'll have to see if I can dig out my experiment data, but it was a good while ago.

Imageshack - dscn1578.jpg - Uploaded by FarrahDay

Incidentally guys, I did use PVC. The solution was inside the capped coil former shown above.

[Farrah Day]

Hi Chet

Btbtw
please stop infering that Chris Hunter is anyone else,
I know who Oswald is and he is not Chris Hunter.

Chris Hunter is a man of "Impeccable moral fiber".

Sorry Chet but I have to disagree. 'Impeccable morale fibre' aside, I'd in fact put money on them being one and the same. Analyse the posts from each and you will not only find that the grammar and syntax is consistent, but so too the attitude of the poster.

Oswaldonfire is AlaskaStar is Chris Hunter.

For this very reason I feel everyone might just be being played... again.

[RAMSET]

Farrah
How about I call the one fellow[Oswald] who lives in New Jersey
Or better yet, How about I go see him on my way home today?

Of course that doesn't rule out the "Evil" twin scenario!


NO never mind I can always do that!

How about we just let Bob run with this without the opera?
And offer help wherever possible!

Chet

[Vickers]

How about add an extra alkaline to the mix? Already got Sodium? Wrapped in plastic. Why not a little potassium? Two dissimilar metals that react with water? A little charge would influence this surely? OF COURSE IT WILL. But hey...Wont know for yourself until u try? But u wont. OR WILL U? Im sure Chris Hunter knows what happens.

[Farrah Day]

Farrah
How about I call the one fellow[Oswald] who lives in New Jersey
Or better yet, How about I go see him on my way home today?


NO never mind I can always do that!

How about we just let Bob run with this without the opera?
And offer help wherever possible!

Chet

Chet, we've known each other for a good while on these forums. You know that I always say what's on my mind... and I know that you tend to get excited and run with whatever is the flavour of the month, often hyping it out of all proportion just as you seem to be doing on Hartmann's site. In some ways I'm simply the negative-ness that neutralises your over-eager positive-ness.

Oswaldonfire openly says that he's in cahoots with AlaskaStar, and that they're working on a powerpoint presentation together. Do you remember AlaskaStar's powerpoint presentation from 2006? The one he never told anyone about at the time until someone inadvertently dug it up.

If they are two different entities, then in many ways this makes it far worse in my eyes, as we now have two people making the claim, with neither of them providing any proof or specifics, yet both saying that they want to open source it. Does this really not seem odd to you, Chet?

And you see Chet, you can no more prove they are two different people than they seem willing to prove their claims.

Obviously our thought processes work on very different levels. You are clearly too trusting, and I'm probably over-cautious and too wary. For these reasons however, I'm far more likely to smell a rat or sense deceit than yourself.

Doubting people is what I do, and more often than not it pays off. I'm also far less disappointed than the likes of you when it all, often inevitably, goes 'tits-up!'

I suggest you do go and see him on the way home, and get him to give AlaskaStar a call while you're there.

Time will tell.

[RAMSET]

Farrah
You left out the "Evil twin" scenario!

However in this case I believe you are right !

"Time will tell"

Chet

[Vickers]

MAGNETIC HYDROGEN PRODUCTION THROUGH INDIRECT ELECTROLYSIS USING MAGNETIC INDUCTION - Flash version, courtesy of PowerShow.com
It makes perfect sense. But is nevertheless pointless in this time.

[Farrah Day]

Farrah
You left out the "Evil twin" scenario!

lol. I'm not averse to the possibility that he has an evil twin or psychotic Mini-Him running around out there somewhere!

[Farrah Day]

That's the one Vickers, well found!

For what it is, it's quite an impressive Powerpoint presentation, but was the project actually the Powerpoint presentation itself and the science all speculative - as I tend to think - or is there any proof of the pudding?

All either of him has to do is show a working model or give specific replication details. Why does this seem to be too much to ask?

[Vickers]

Cool. Do u understand y it is pointless? Farrah?