None Electrolytic Splitting Of H2o

[Duncan]

You do not need to use tubes, you can use two end fed antennas and bent into a circle so as to fit inside your WFC. Here are the sizes:-

VHF antenna @120mhz

640mm long "quarter wave length" bent into a circle.

UHF antenna @720mhz

213mm long "half wave length" bent into a circle.

Each antenna can be made of 1/4" copper tube, in one end fit and solder an RF female connector "as used in CB or amature radio". If laid flat on a table, bend up vertical the connection end so as the male plug and feed cable can be connected easily. There should be a space between the two ends of the antenna of about 28mm. This should give you a diameter on the VHF of about 205mm and the UHF 75mm.

The UHF is placed in the center of the VHF antenna and a plastic suport has to be made to hold them in this position and so as they can be suported in a horizontal plane inside the WFC.

This is less complicated than using tubes within tubes and is designed for cold vapour and not immersed in water. This will give better gas production, as said before a larger H2O molecular surface area. A standard humidity vapouriser can be used in the bottom of the cell to produce the vapour.

This is not the complicated part, but the electronics is and has to be right.

Mike

I Think I’ll have a go at these antennas whilst waiting for the components to arrive I make the revised sizes
VHF antenna @ 135Mhz
560mm long quarter wave length bent into a circle

UHF antenna 186 mm half wave length bent into a circle

Should give a VHF diameter of circa 187mm and UHF of 68mm with the gaps

I’ll just wait for Mike to check my scribble though unless there’s another antenna guy out there to check my ramblings.

[Duncan]

We are not looking for a fogger but rather a humidifier as nvisser mentions. A fogger creates a mist which have very little velocity and in the type of construction that is described by both Mike and the patent, we can clearly see that the water molecules is passing the interference area in the top of the unit. A simple fogger would require that the interference area is placed in the bottom of the unit. Do watch this video where a ultrasonic humidifier is described. And keep up the good work.

Deconstructed: How Ultrasound Humidifiers Work. Discovery Ch - Science EP.

Thanks for this … I’m living and learning!!!

[SeaMonkey]

Since the antennae are "bent into a circle" to conform
to the shape of the device, would it not be possible to
use loop antennae?

Is that what you've described?

I Think I’ll have a go at these antennas whilst waiting for the components to arrive I make the revised sizes
VHF antenna @ 135Mhz
560mm long quarter wave length bent into a circle

UHF antenna 186 mm half wave length bent into a circle

Should give a VHF diameter of circa 187mm and UHF of 68mm with the gaps

I’ll just wait for Mike to check my scribble though unless there’s another antenna guy out there to check my ramblings.

[Duncan]

Hi seamonkey – I posted a few magnetic loop designs earlier but I don’t think It’s the way Mike intends to go, quite apart from any of my observations, (which are pretty irrelevant compared to someone who’s actually “done it”) Mikes Machine worked and so if it aint broke don’t fix it! It’s also as Kiss as it gets.
You will also notice a few links back(post310)) Mike mentions that high voltage plays a part, reading between the lines I assume this to be the voltage gradient of the standing wave on the antenna (and across the container) that would be very different for a magnetic loop
On Mikes drawing (post 59) it’s stated that the screen of both feeder coaxes are grounded to the container case and also earthed, so even if I tried to use a loop I wouldn’t really know how to connect it.
It seems to me that the characteristic impedance is going to (in some part at least) involve tuning to the antennas AND the container. If I had to make a guess I would say a Balun is going to come into play.
Still like you sea monkey I initially thought a loop was a reasonable idea but you have to agree this arrangement is a far cry from a standard TX, Still I recon not many folks are used to transmitting into a bucket!!!
I have simply ratio scaled the frequencies to try and get to the required sizes for the revised antenna’s
Still thanks for your Input Sea monkey after all it only takes someone to inject a “nugget” to revolutionize what is already an amazing concept.

[tutanka]

@ All

Well just got in and waiting to use the bathroom, so I will use this 5min to explain a little further.

The explination in that patent is not fully correct and there are parts missing of which I was the only person that knew. The heterodyning actually takes place within the denser water molecule not in the air, the water molecule absorbs the RF at these frequencies.

High voltage is a part and has not been explained yet, but hope to explain more in the US for those whom want a bit of a lecture over a beer

Mike

The RF heterodyne field creating an cold plasma (RADIANT ENERGY) inside the container energize the water and cut hydrogen bonds of water. The special HV field mentioned from Mike add ONLY two electrons on oxygen atom changing electronic structure of water. In all case you obtain BROWN GAS and not hydrogen/oxygen!!

Wiseman theory of extra electrons is been proved from Chris Eckman.

Chris wrote... " I tested the unlit gas and lit gas. I found that lit gas is exposed to two pieces of metal (about 5 mm away from each other) it will give a voltage of about 1.4 V and through a fuel cell it gave 5 V. The metals I used were Copper and Aluminum there were 2 flat panels about 3’ x 3’ large and they were oriented to just barely hit the beam of the browns gas. The unlit gas seemed unresponsive to these test. I did notice a static spike during the lighting process, however have no explanation for it (I first thought it was a malfunction…). My teacher pointed out that this may be an effect similar to a thermocoupler; in witch heat is turned into electricity by means of the beam of burning browns gas."

From that explaination is clear that extra electrons are released from burned brown gas creating battery effect..

I'm sure that you can create the same effect on water using ONLY DC/HV to high frequency for create directly brown gas from water.. of course .. you obtain better results of production using ultrasonic water atomization

First is ONLY Important understand the working principle, for that I suggest to read ONLY Wiseman explaination .. you can create the same effect on water with not complicated circuits using ONLY DC/HV to high frequency for create directly brown gas from water. YOU DON'T NEED METAL PLATES OR ELECTROLYTE BUT ONLY AN RADIANT ENERGY ANTENNA!!!

[Duncan]

OOOH ... much reading! Thanks Tutanka I'll put my nose into it and see how much sticks.I Just love this guys approach Tutanka Eagle-Research:I think I’m going to enjoy reading some of this even if I don’t understand it all!

[tutanka]

OOOH ... much reading! Thanks Tutanka I'll put my nose into it and see how much sticks.I Just love this guys approach Tutanka Eagle-Research:I think I’m going to enjoy reading some of this even if I don’t understand it all!

George Wiseman defines Brown’s Gas as: “The entire mixture of gasses evolving from an electrolyzer specifically designed to electrolyze water and not separate the resulting gasses.”

You can call brown gas "Electrically Expanded Water Molecule".

You need to energize water not apply voltage!! This step is very important to understand.. energize with cold plasma and add free electrons at the same time and you obtain brown gas in large amount, no plates or electrolyte are needed. You must delete these old info from your mind

Normally water with electrolyte (conductive) is energized using metal plates, without electrolyte don't exist propagation of energy trought water molecules!
Now we need to understand what appear inside cell formed from two plates, one positive one negative. Gap from plates is little, we are asking of millimeters, but in the middle of plates appear one little plasma line produced from current. Also the current produce production of free electrons from metal plates, more electrolyte more free electrons productions.

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Hi Mike, will you be on the West Coast?

Sorry Harvey just seen this, I will be in Coeur d'alene from the 11th until the 15th with Aaron, Peter, John and the rest, would be good to see you there!

Mike

[Michael John Nunnerley]

A new thread

The RF heterodyne field creating an cold plasma (RADIANT ENERGY) inside the container energize the water and cut hydrogen bonds of water. The special HV field mentioned from Mike add ONLY two electrons on oxygen atom changing electronic structure of water. In all case you obtain BROWN GAS and not hydrogen/oxygen!!

Wiseman theory of extra electrons is been proved from Chris Eckman.

Chris wrote... " I tested the unlit gas and lit gas. I found that lit gas is exposed to two pieces of metal (about 5 mm away from each other) it will give a voltage of about 1.4 V and through a fuel cell it gave 5 V. The metals I used were Copper and Aluminum there were 2 flat panels about 3’ x 3’ large and they were oriented to just barely hit the beam of the browns gas. The unlit gas seemed unresponsive to these test. I did notice a static spike during the lighting process, however have no explanation for it (I first thought it was a malfunction…). My teacher pointed out that this may be an effect similar to a thermocoupler; in witch heat is turned into electricity by means of the beam of burning browns gas."

From that explaination is clear that extra electrons are released from burned brown gas creating battery effect..

I'm sure that you can create the same effect on water using ONLY DC/HV to high frequency for create directly brown gas from water.. of course .. you obtain better results of production using ultrasonic water atomization

First is ONLY Important understand the working principle, for that I suggest to read ONLY Wiseman explaination .. you can create the same effect on water with not complicated circuits using ONLY DC/HV to high frequency for create directly brown gas from water. YOU DON'T NEED METAL PLATES OR ELECTROLYTE BUT ONLY AN RADIANT ENERGY ANTENNA!!!

Hi All

I have started a new thread for discution of this, so as to keep this thread on track

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...om-theory.html

Mike

[Harvey]

Sorry Harvey just seen this, I will be in Coeur d'alene from the 11th until the 15th with Aaron, Peter, John and the rest, would be good to see you there!

Mike

Thanx Mike,

I would love to attend and meet everyone in person, but Coeur d'alene is quite some distance from my location and at present I do not have the funds to make the trip. I wonder if NARF would want to send me

I was using Google to look for your conference details and found this instead:
DHS | OSDBU Conferences
HS will be there on Nov. 4th - probably bugging the building

Seriously though, I will ask NARF if they want to send me up there, but they will probably want to know more about it - can you PM the details?

Thanx

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Thanx Mike,

I would love to attend and meet everyone in person, but Coeur d'alene is quite some distance from my location and at present I do not have the funds to make the trip. I wonder if NARF would want to send me

I was using Google to look for your conference details and found this instead:
DHS | OSDBU Conferences
HS will be there on Nov. 4th - probably bugging the building

Seriously though, I will ask NARF if they want to send me up there, but they will probably want to know more about it - can you PM the details?

Thanx

Hi Harvey, all is here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...onvention.html

Yes we will have to do a sweep and debug

Mike

[tutanka]

Hi All

I have started a new thread for discution of this, so as to keep this thread on track

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...om-theory.html

Mike

Sorry Mike .. but don't uderstand the sense.. You need to be clear if you don't want that peoples theorize about your RF reaction.. RF split water in hydrogen/oxygen or create brown gas? An extra HV field must be present and what is the real function? And if hydrogen/oxygen are created how you can separated these?? An simple bi-tube used for separated gasses as present on patent is ridicule.

[Slovenia]

Updated PDF File of This Thread

An updated pdf file of this thread was just uploaded to Page 3 of this section. It is updated through October 27, 2010.

[Duncan]

Use a Bucket? What bloody idiot suggested that? Don’t go there, too weak and looks bloody awful! I refuse to post a picture of this mangled abortion!
If you’ve got a heavy duty one that cows kick around or a thing like this Heavy Duty Tar Bucket - Screwfix.com, Where the Trade Buys … perhaps …Meanwhile I’ll have to settle down and do the job properly.
Still bits arriving in dribs and drabs in the mean time and perhaps pertinent I include the link to Mr. Charles Cameron’s patent. It’s a bit of a chew to get through but I include it a/ because he’s operating up and around the same frequency that Mike has directed our efforts to. His description of the RF tubes like Meyer and Puharich’s is vague (you can’t blame these guys they hoped to make a few $s out of their efforts but thanks to Mike we now know that bit!)
And perhaps more interestingly b/ His claim to have a simplified system to separate the Hydrogen and Oxygen for consumption ON DEMAND using what seems to be an adaptation of the fracturing method Mike has enlightened us with, and so It could I suggest possibly withstand further investigation and thought. I haven’t digested it all yet (its hard work for a wooden top), but I feel sure it’s pertinent.
Perhaps one of the chemist types would be so kind as to enlighten me on a possible composition of component 34 Systems for the decomposition of water Doesn’t the last sentence say it all?”an electromagnetic shield through which paramagnetic molecules can pass while diamagnetic molecules are deflected therefrom”
Super if it works and I feel I’m on the right forum to ask!!

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Use a Bucket? What bloody idiot suggested that? Don’t go there, too weak and looks bloody awful! I refuse to post a picture of this mangled abortion!
If you’ve got a heavy duty one that cows kick around or a thing like this Heavy Duty Tar Bucket - Screwfix.com, Where the Trade Buys … perhaps …Meanwhile I’ll have to settle down and do the job properly.
Still bits arriving in dribs and drabs in the mean time and perhaps pertinent I include the link to Mr. Charles Cameron’s patent. It’s a bit of a chew to get through but I include it a/ because he’s operating up and around the same frequency that Mike has directed our efforts to. His description of the RF tubes like Meyer and Puharich’s is vague (you can’t blame these guys they hoped to make a few $s out of their efforts but thanks to Mike we now know that bit!)
And perhaps more interestingly b/ His claim to have a simplified system to separate the Hydrogen and Oxygen for consumption ON DEMAND using what seems to be an adaptation of the fracturing method Mike has enlightened us with, and so It could I suggest possibly withstand further investigation and thought. I haven’t digested it all yet (its hard work for a wooden top), but I feel sure it’s pertinent.
Perhaps one of the chemist types would be so kind as to enlighten me on a possible composition of component 34 Systems for the decomposition of water Doesn’t the last sentence say it all?”an electromagnetic shield through which paramagnetic molecules can pass while diamagnetic molecules are deflected therefrom”
Super if it works and I feel I’m on the right forum to ask!!

Nice find Duncan, seems that this guy was on to the same system of H2O splitting in 1992 and shows a very similar tube system used by me of which you can see posted some time ago on my youtube channel "centraflow", albeit my configuration was a little different due to utilising the nitrogen in my system.

What I have shown here on this thread is the principle of the breaking of the water molecule to H and O with remarkable effect, as I have said before, not only here but on other threads is that this is taken to a higher level and to other gases which are more usable at the end of the day, than just H and O or HHO.

I take my hat off to this guy and I don't think it is any copy of mine unlike the other which is blatently obvious taken from my original drawings, and if the examiner did his work properly, a patent would not have been issued.

Mike