Discussion. Best way to use heat from HHO to generate electricity

[FRC]

Slovenia

Slovenia,
Thank you for your interest but really, these are old findings of others that I just have happened to stumbled upon. I am your equal, no more and no less.

I told someone last week of the water fog injection at the local discount store, he bought a
Vicks Ultrasonic Humidifier - $40
Small inverter -$30
Set of E3 plugs - $30

I saw him today at the Store and he happily reported gains of above 30% mpg for his mileage during this past week. He said it will be better as he's at 10% oil life and doing an oil change. Simple off the shelf items that will help with lower your fuel expenses. He only duct taped a piece of water hose to the humidifier vent and inserted it into the air intake.

I wanted to try gasoline but will try this first and see what happens. From
reviews I have read about the E3 plugs (not very favorable), I will just try
it with my existing plugs at first.

FRC

[ewizard]

As much as I would like to try this I feel like powerme abandoned us and left us without some needed info. Two problems I saw were finding the proper ultrasonic transducer at the correct frequency or how to make one operate at that frequency. Harder than it might seem and I suspect it involves having the correct size disc as well as the right circuit to vibrate it. The other big problem was how to get the ZnO crystals attached to something. We were left with little info on either of these points. I can understand how he wanted us to think for ourselves but with nearly infinite variables in something new it could take a lot of experimenting and reading to get something working unless the parameters to get it working are not at all critical. At this point I have to wonder if we were not just being used to test his theories. Otherwise he would have shown us some pictures as that surely was conveyed as something that would have been very motivating as well as helping us understand how it goes together.

As it is most replicators try doing little things differently so it's not like it would have stifled our inventiveness to have some pictures.

[petar113507]

Thank you.

I've stayed quiet on my replication efforts because I felt I was cluttering the threads with my questions. I apologize if others thought there was a lack of interest in this project.

Regardless, I have most of the answers I feel I needed to complete the project, though hands-on-experimenting. This is what powerme was encouraging us to do in the first place, to work and observe carefully. I do not yet have an assembeled prototype, but I felt it was not too soon to share some of my test results, and what they might imply.

This IS in fact, a viable way to produce HHO. Either with the ionizer, or with the ZnO crystals, you are doing the same thing. Physics would call it "dis-associaton" of the molecular bonds, walter russell would call those molecular bonds, the tonal (electric) pressure walls.

This is a highly interesting feild, but you must be generative in the way you look for your information. You cannot be spoon fed, and you must be able to ask questions towards your solution or goal.

I've used walter russell as a good "guide" to explain what is aparrent changes to the light undergoes, behind the illusion we perceive as reality.

High positive electrical pressure (high voltage) will dis-associate the water molecules from the ionizer, if you blow it through from the pizeo transducer.

When the pizeo crystals flex, they create the electric pressure differences conditions nescessary to dis-associate the water into a gas.

If you would like to ask how I came to these conclusions, I will share my tests, and test results.

Powerme posted the details on his ZnO crystal "cooking", I will share the "off the shelf" ionizer parts (it is jetijs's ionizer).

Powerme, thank you for your introduction to these forbidden zones of knowledge.

==Romo

[petar113507]

As much as I would like to try this I feel like powerme abandoned us and left us without some needed info. Two problems I saw were finding the proper ultrasonic transducer at the correct frequency or how to make one operate at that frequency. Harder than it might seem and I suspect it involves having the correct size disc as well as the right circuit to vibrate it. The other big problem was how to get the ZnO crystals attached to something. We were left with little info on either of these points. I can understand how he wanted us to think for ourselves but with nearly infinite variables in something new it could take a lot of experimenting and reading to get something working unless the parameters to get it working are not at all critical. At this point I have to wonder if we were not just being used to test his theories. Otherwise he would have shown us some pictures as that surely was conveyed as something that would have been very motivating as well as helping us understand how it goes together.

As it is most replicators try doing little things differently so it's not like it would have stifled our inventiveness to have some pictures.

Would you like me to give you a lengthy explanation, or just the internet links that solve the problems?

He gave us the working parameters we needed. You need to test, and work with those parameters to understand what you are doing. I will write more when I can get back online.

==Romo

[FRC]

Great

It's very nice to see people posting again on this thread!!!

Yes all this fresh new info is good to see. Please keep it coming, it helps to put
all the pieces together.

FRC

[petar113507]

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As much as I would like to try this I feel like powerme abandoned us and left us without some needed info. Two problems I saw were finding the proper ultrasonic transducer at the correct frequency or how to make one operate at that frequency. Harder than it might seem and I suspect it involves having the correct size disc as well as the right circuit to vibrate it.
=============================================

Size of the transducer is unimportant. The correct frequency is what is important -- it needs to operate between 40-50 KHZ. You can find these used, or new -- used are cheaper. If you live near hospitals, you can ask some of the ultrasound technicians for the used pizeo-heads from their machines. They replace the pizeo heads in their machines, and you can find some used for under 50 Dollars. These transducer heads are good to be submersible. Some of the ultrasound machines have different frequencies -- I have one that runs about 45 KHZ (+/-) 1.5 KHZ.

If you do not live near one and want a link, I can provide the same link Rad-HHO suggested to me -- they sell very large pizeo heads.

You will need to seal them with silicone caulk, meant for aquariums, or high strength generic epoxy. I sealed mine into the bottom of a 2 inch steel cap. (the kind of end cap you have for PVC pipes) The silicone and expoxy will dampen the waves emitted, but if you have a big enough transducer head (1 - 2 inches +), this doesn't really dampen the waves enough to affect the crystal flexing.

You can still acheive the same effect in different ways, if you understand the conditions you are producing on the crystal surface, or on the ionizer tips.

The larger the transducer, the more powerful the waves you will be generating (bigger waves in the water). If you use a smaller head, you will probably want to find your own way to seal it into a smaller end cap, and might want to use a horn to amplify the waves.

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The other big problem was how to get the ZnO crystals attached to something. We were left with little info on either of these points. I can understand how he wanted us to think for ourselves but with nearly infinite variables in something new it could take a lot of experimenting and reading to get something working unless the parameters to get it working are not at all critical.
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I do not know if it is my own perception which has led me to the same simple method. As far as I have seen, I have only read carefully what I think powerme meant, and took a bit of a leap of faith.

This might be similar to how Wattson simply understood the principal behind the "1984 FEG" ala bendini, and was able to build it and demonstrate it. The difference here, is that I would like to clairify to the best of my understanding so that others may also experiment with this.

I can at least help the members of this forum make a fuel booster to increase the MPG to a car. This much I can boast -- a low power onboard fuel booster. The only modifications you may need to add to your car, is modifying the oxygen sensor (in more modern cars), and perhaps to add another car battery or two (24-36 V).

The extent to which this fuel booster for your car can function, depends soley on your abillity to tune it to your specific car's needs. I don't want to make this sound very intimidating at all, because this is basically tuning two potentiometers.

Not all of the working parameters are critical. You have lots of "wiggle room".

I am currently in the process of working with a mechanic in my home town to figure out how to adapt these boosters into most car engines.

================================================== ==
At this point I have to wonder if we were not just being used to test his theories. Otherwise he would have shown us some pictures as that surely was conveyed as something that would have been very motivating as well as helping us understand how it goes together.
================================================== ==

I find that This is your speculation. I did not know if the transistor's, or diodes would function "exactly as it was said" on the internet -- I only had the faith that the people who sold them to me, would also be honest salesmen, and that they would. When I put them into the cirucit, "Presto!"

They worked.

What is the difference between that, and you reading powerme's posts, or anyone on this forum for that matter?
If you were an 18th century "scientist" --- to conduct an experiment that you simply read about was prettymuch your only option. You had to discern the good and bad observations for yourself. That's all we are comparing anyways, through our mental models -- our observations.

What about reading stuff on wikipedia, or science papers, or textbooks? I find there is no difference -- some are correct, and some are not. Even academic textbooks can be wrong. You must be able to discern the good information, from the bad yourself. I will do my best to only give the helpful, good information. I hope others will do the same.

I personally do not happen to have access to the high tech lab which will allow me to confirm the results from an academic textbook -- I simply trust that they are explaining what they are observing as the best of their abillities will allow. Basically, I don't know if it'll work until I try it.

I tried this one, and It is paying off several months later -- and it will continue to do so with the oppourtunities it will allow me.

We're all in this global mess together -- and it's about time we all started to band together and at least TRY to help improve our situation. If you're reading this now, I ask -- Where does change in mankind start?

Does it start with one invention that can change the world, and it acts upon its own to change?

If this were true, I beleive tesla's machines and observations would have long since resculpted the planet.

Or, does it begin with The Person who puts themselves out there and tries to get other people to band together for a common goal, who changes the world?

I beleive it is the latter, as when tesla presented his Magnifying transmitter and observations -- He effectively said "the world is not ready for this machine". I have found Walter Russell's work to be met with equal resistance -- perhaps the world is not yet ready for either of these works. Here we find again, it is the cry of mankind to try to change the world. Together, we CAN make a change.

I feel privileged to have understood powerme, and now wish to help "translate" some of the things which were mis-understood. I do not want people to gloss over this, as understanding the phase transitions of elements leads to knowledge that you will not learn from the academia.

You can beleive, or disbelieve me as you will -- you will never know for certain, the knowledge no-one will tell you, unless you try it out for yourself.

==Romo

[petar113507]

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What We Don't Know:

1) The actual configuration of power1's cell.
2) We don't know the actual configuration of his transducer.
3) How he plated his zinc crystals onto surfaces.
4) Which surfaces he coated with the zinc crystals.
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I cannot tell you what his exact configuration was. I am not telepathic, nor have I seen his setup. I can, however, discuss the working parameters of this stuff.

If you ask specific questions to your problems, I can help you solve it -- and others reading it will be given a example "FAQ" of sorts.

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5) Anything about his lead sulfide 24/7 battery cell that collected all the energy. This was to be the next project he talked about.
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To be honest, I'm looking into this myself. We are using the same effects of pizeo/thermo-electrics. I'm mulling over "the universal one" of russell to get some leads here. I don't have answers here, sorry.

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6) How he attached his transducer to the cell. He said it was very important to do this right and that he would help us later on this aspect.
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Since you are one who is still interested in this project, What do you need help with in attaching your transducer to your cell? What are your current limits? What matierals do you have?

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7) He didn't show us a diagram of his Pierce JT Circuit configuration nor was he specific as to the actual specific components he used. He vaguely summarized what components he used without getting specific.
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Powerme did not explain everything to us -- much like academic papers will "cite their sources" to support their points in leu of explaining it themselves (and becomming quite redundant in the process) -- if you did a little research on the circuit, you can find all the components of the JT circuit you need.

The JT circuit at the OU forums will work fine. If you need to tune it, I have a friend at an electronics store who can help tune the circuit. PM me, and we can discuss shipping.

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8) He also said he would help us design the chamber later. This never happened.
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Which chamber do you need help designing? The parameters here aren't very critical.

I Offer my help to anyone who is interested enough to try to build it themselves. I will work with you to make your own designs, but I will not design them for you. I can make suggestions towards building materials which should work towards that designed task -- but I would put more of an emphasis on looking for local materials that you can use.


I hope this generates interest. I will share as much as I can in hope that my efforts will help the rest of us will also follow suit. As an entire species, we need to GIVE more, and being KIND to your fellow human. It has been through taking that we've gotten into this mess. I beleive it will be through its opposite, through love and giving that we will find our way out into the solution.

Change, must start somewhere. I hope my burning desire for change, may ignite the spark of action in others.



I still have hope. Peace, brothers.

==Romo

[FRC]

Thanks Romo

Thanks Romo for all the info. You confirmed what I had suspected. I have had an ultrasound device all along but did not know for sure that it had a piezo
transducer. I meant to test it with water, but did not get around to it. Not sure
what its frequency would be. Will have to try it and see what happens.

FRC

[petar113507]

I am back home now for a couple weeks. Got an ultrasonic humidifier and want to try either a gasoline vaporization or a water vaporization setup on my car first. Slovenia, looks like the tread at OU is dying also. Has anyone had any further success ? Would be nice to see this discussion kept alive.

FRC

Hey FRC. Are you still thinking about gasoline vaporization? I can offer suggestions and some pictures to my setup that also vaporizes gasoline. The way I use to regulate gas flow + water mixture is with a couple of metal ball valves.

The mixture of water/gas can be made to be combustable with a butane lighter, or with enough water in it that is completely unvolatile with another flame present. I have not been able to test this with an open plasma spark yet -- and (like I said) I am working with a mechanic to install it into a car.

When I get back from the electronics store today with some of my older recpits I will post jetijs's ionizer details with the parts I used.


==Romo

[petar113507]

Wil add part specs later...

Cap 250V, .68uf
ECQ-E2684KF Panasonic Electronic Components Polyester Film Capacitors

10K resistor, .25W
MFS1/4DCT52A1002F KOA Speer Metal Film Resistors - Through Hole

470, 2W
PR02000204700JR500 Vishay/BC Components Metal Film Resistors - Through Hole

Inductor:
2314-V J.W. Miller Power Inductors

Zener diode: (only one I don't have a link for)
12V, 1A

IRFP240's -- (you'll want the picture which tells you which to direction the internal diode points to put it in the circuit properly, I found it somewhere in a book)

IRFP240PBF Vishay/Siliconix MOSFET Power

"Big diodes" (Dont know specs off top of head)
UF5408-E3/54 Vishay Semiconductors Rectifiers

I am sorry this is less complete than I would like, and significantly later than I'd have hoped. I have only included where I got my parts from, but am in no way affiliated with that company. (Mouser)

If you look at each of the links, you should be able to find each component's specific details. If you don't feel like looking at the links, I'm putting this together into a PDF soon anyways. Will take pics of it hooked up to the flyback transformer later.

==Romo

[FRC]

Romo

Hey FRC. Are you still thinking about gasoline vaporization? I can offer suggestions and some pictures to my setup that also vaporizes gasoline. The way I use to regulate gas flow + water mixture is with a couple of metal ball valves.

The mixture of water/gas can be made to be combustable with a butane lighter, or with enough water in it that is completely unvolatile with another flame present. I have not been able to test this with an open plasma spark yet -- and (like I said) I am working with a mechanic to install it into a car.

When I get back from the electronics store today with some of my older recpits I will post jetijs's ionizer details with the parts I used.


==Romo

Yes Romo I would welcome any suggestions and pictures. A mixture of water/gas was also something I was considering. Have you found the
optimum proportions of each to use ?

George

[petar113507]

Hey FRC. Sorry it took so long to get back to you.

I used metal PVC tubes that screw into each other. These tubes can handle the gasoline I throw in there. The pipe in on the side is to pour both the fuel in when required, and to connect to an air pump. So far on this prototype, I've taped plastic bags together with fans to push the air through the fuel mixture.

Side view of the pipe -- the fuel line hose on the side for air and fuel input:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...E/photo3-1.jpg

I am toying with using my room mate to help me program some sensors into the sides of these tubes. The microcrontrollers should be Arduino. This is going in an automated direction for me -- so that the system for fuel would be hands free, and more permernantly attached to the engine.

This is a top shot inside the tube -- I used epoxy and an off-the-shelf pond fogger, which vibrates at 1.7 MHZ
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...CE/photo-1.jpg

I fill in a little bit of water in the bottom until it covers the wires so that everything is safe from gasoline corrosion. Ideally in future builds, I would have drilled the electrical out the bottom instead of the side.

Hook it all together to the same blowing fan, and have one side's mister running just water mist -- and the other side pour gasoline on the water layer -- and the gasoline gets the same "mist". By controlling the red ball valves on top -- I can get rough ballpark figures of how much gas I am allowing to mix through the central output.

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...E/photo2-1.jpg

I can get a flamethrower to come out of the top of the tube pretty well at about 70-30 gasoline and water mixture. the water does not allow it to be as flamable at 60-40.

I can hook it up to the intake manifold of a lawn mower engine and get it running without much any difference on that mixture. (60-40)

At around 50-50 mixture, it starts to sound like it's running a little funny with regular sparkplugs. Upgraded spark plugs can knock off a 55% gasoline like a champ. This is without HHO production in the opposing cylinder, mind you.

I look at this small unit, and I think I might even be producing too much fuel for a small single cyllinder lawn mower. I use a different valve on the intake manifold to moderate the mixture, to make sure I am not burning it too rich.

I have let the engine run on a small measured quantity of fuel, until it "ran out" -- for about five minutes runtime. Using the same quantity of fuel, I could extend the runtime easily to seven or eight minutes using small measured increments poured into ultrasonic transducer chamber. This is a rough test, but this test was effectively me throwing the stuff together to see how it would work "as is".

If this isn't showing promising potential -- I suggest looking for a different project. I am quite excited to develop this more.

The pond fogger was about thirty bucks -- fuel line and steel pipes and valves set me up to about 70-80 bucks.

If anyone is looking to work with me attach this to cars, and help me obtain results -- I can help you replicate this by instruction, but this is really quite simple.

I need to select different atomizer heads to purchase, and use the JT circuit found earlier in this thread to make it also produce the nescessary "fog" for the atomizing chamber. With that, the atomizer could be run off a 12V battery in the car -- and should be a straightforeward modification from there. I am working with a mechanic on this process -- I would like to encourage other people in other places to do the same thing.

If you're sick of gas prices already -- or are looking for a way to reduce your fuel consumption on the road -- this is a very cheap modification to get more "bang for your buck" in the car.

Further improvements will be comming with the ionizer.

Is this reaching anyone?

==Romo

[FRC]

Thanks Romo

Thanks Romo, I will have to re-read your post and study it more. I was hoping
to try the basic water vaporization on my 1987 Volvo. It has fuel injection and
a more complicated air filter setup than I was expecting. Have been very sick with the flu lately, so have not got around to it.

FRC

[sucahyo]

Still following the thread, please keep sharing, thanks .

[Slovenia]

Power1 KEY

I stumbled onto this today at Ionization X. It was from an old March 22, 2011 post where Power1 was sharing a link to the sites such as this one where he published his details.

Key:
Key is atomizing chamber with receiver cells plated with ZnO allowing
amplifications of interia motion, many geometries will works.

Link to Power1 Posts at Ionization X
http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php?topic=1961.0