Kanarev Cone Water Cell

[Aaron]

A friend out near Idaho knows a rancher running a tractor on 100% water according to his claims. He is using a water cell using cones as the electrodes. He is using dairy creamer separator discs like these:



Kanarev's cell using cones is supposed to be self-polarizing by virtue of the geometry where the top cone is always positive and the bottom is always negative and all the metal is the same.

Does anyone here have any experience with this?

If it is self polarizing and can keep the water molecules polarized, then obviously less input is required and this indeed seems to be the case according to Kanarev's claims. Simply pulsing them periodically, the gas production continues as the power is off way more than on.


ELECTROLYTIC CELL OF LOW-AMPERE ELECTROLYZER FOR PRODUCTION OF HYDROGEN AND OXYGEN FROM WATER
RU2227817
( 4-27-2004)
KANAREV F M; PODOBEDOV V V; TLISHEV A I






Classification: - international: C25B1/04; C25B9/06; C25B1/00; C25B9/06; (IPC1-7): C25B1/04; C25B9/0
Abstract ~ Physico-chemical technologies for production of hydrogen and oxygen from water. SUBSTANCE: proposed electrolytic cell has taper housing made from current-conducting material and used as cathode, additional taper electrodes and taper cover made from current-conducting material and used as anode. Cylindrical bases of housing, additional electrodes and cover have circular recesses for dielectric rings. Housing, additional electrodes and cover are connected by means of bolts inserted into holes in cylindrical bases. Insulation between anode, additional electrodes and cathode is insured by dielectric rings, dielectric washers and dielectric bushes. Solution is fed from reservoir to inter-electrode space through passage. Gases escape through branch pipe. Proposed cell may be used for polarization of ions of solution and water molecules in horizontal and vertical planes, thus forming positive potential on anode and negative potential on cathode before connecting the cell to electric circuit; process of separation of gases continues after disconnection of cell from circuit. EFFECT: considerable reduction of power requirements for decomposition of water.
DEVICE FOR PRODUCTION OF HYDROGEN AND OXYGEN
RU2232829
( 7-20-2004 )
KANAREV F M (RU); PODOBEDOV V V (RU); TLISHEV A I (RU); PEREKOTIJ G P (RU); KORNEEV D V (RU); BEBKO D A (RU)






Classification: - international: C25B1/04; C25B1/00; (IPC1-7): C25B1/04
Abstract ~ Physico-chemical technologies of hydrogen and oxygen production. SUBSTANCE: the invention is dealt with the physico-chemical technologies of production of hydrogen and oxygen. The device has a cylindrical body manufactured of a dielectric material, an interelectrode chamber, a cathode with a conical outer surface, with a lower branch-pipe and an axial aperture for feeding a solution, an anode with a conical inside surface and the upper branch-pipe and an axial aperture for gases exit. The body has the hollow electrodes of a conical form inserted into it and having axial apertures, diameters of which are step by step increasing in direction from the cathode to the anode. The electrodes are isolated from each other by seal dielectric rings. The technical effect is production of hydrogen and oxygen using a low-amper electrolytic decomposition of water and decreased power input. EFFECT: the invention allows to produce hydrogen and oxygen using a low-amper electrolytic decomposition of water and to decrease power input.

[Cherryman]

Hi Aaron,

It reminds me of two things:

1- The Joe cell Because it "stays" energized, and has multiple ringed layers
2- Vid14 Volcano Cell Hydrogen Generator Redesign (HHO, Brown's Gas, Hydroxy) - YouTube

Just to inform, Peace.

C'man

[Aaron]

self polarizing

When I did a bunch of concentric tube tests - just 2 tubes neg inside and pos outside and conditioned them so the white coating is on the cathode, it stayed polarized for weeks after turning it off. It sat at a permanent 2 volts even when shorted out and only lost the potential difference when the white coating (calcium or magnesium) was wiped off.

[Aaron]

Uncle Jaque's Cone Stack HHO Generator

Here are some plans from someone building a cone cell:

Fuel Enhancement pictures by UncleJaque - Photobucket

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Hi Aaron

The idea of using cone shape is a good idea just by the geometric form.

For the best results the applied current should be of pulsed frequency and the cones should be insulated from the water.

What happens is that with pulsed current "AC", you have your two connections to the cones which are ANODES, not anode and cathode as in DC. When you insulate these then the outer surface of the insulation becomes a VIRTUAL cathode. Electrons then move from this cathode to the anode in a half cycle and in reverse in the other half cycle, as in AC, or in one direction if it is pulsed DC.

You also have to use high voltage, higher the better, this changes to high current inside the water molecule when it is hit by the electrons.

This is what Meyer did, nothing complicated, but frequency does make a difference in performance.

Hope this helps

Mike

[stevie1001]

Dear Mike,

Please correct me, but the whole thing of using insulation is to prevent electron flow? And is it not so that a charge in water is carried by ions?

Regards
Steve

[ashtweth]

Cones are used in etheric rain engineering as Trevor found that they were the best "sink" for the energy

Yes energy, my useless 2 cents for today

Ash

[Michelinho]

Hi all,

I think using cones make sense and Uncle Jaque's Cone Stack HHO Generator built even better. I like the idea of using pulse AC but pulse DC is not out yet.

Using Pulse DC, the cell will work best with the right polarity.

The ions travel from one plate to the other. From electroplating and HHO cell experiments the ions travel perpendicular to the plates and in straight line and arrive perpendicular at the other plate.
I have seen cells using 7 Amps and only 2 Amps when the polarity was reversed and producing as much.
The good flow of electrolyte will have to be tuned from spacing between cones to the center hole diameters. If tune, the cell will have a nice water and gaz flow from top to bottom in a great spin.

Take care all, whatever 2012 will bring us.

Michel

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Dear Mike,

Please correct me, but the whole thing of using insulation is to prevent electron flow? And is it not so that a charge in water is carried by ions?

Regards
Steve

Hi Steve

What happens in pulsed DC is that your connection to the ANODE which is covered by an insulation "dielectric" forms a charge on the surface of the dielectric, this becomes then a virtual Cathode. A discharge then arises from this virtual cathode to the other ANODE "distance about 2mm". Electrons move at high velocity to that ANODE when it is switched to ground "pulsed DC using two ANODES, positive, ground, positive, ground etc".

This can be seen in DBD, dielectric barrier discharge. The emitted electrons knock electrons out of orbit in the H=O=H bond of water causing the bonds to break. There is NO direct electrical path from one electrode to the other as the electrodes are insulated.

This discharge can be created with low current, high voltage, but when the electrons hit one another in the discharge, a high current evolves in that discharge "energy is released through chemical change of the water to hydrogen and oxygen". The electrons in the bond "covalant" of H and O are knocked into a lower orbit and so break the common electron bond, they go their own way to look for new electrons to bond to.

Now moving a little further beyond this thread, if you introduce another element which the H and O would like to bond to, to make another different covalent bond, as in CH3, then you really have a unique system of manipulation of chemical bonds. This later is work that I do and will shortly be published.

Mike