Wind issuing from ends of wires? Have I separated electrons from the aether?

[Inquorate]

It seems to me that ion wind doesn't explain the following effects

YouTube - playing with purple gaseous discharge while making hv epoxy electret so prrdee

YouTube - gas issuing from hv wire pushing divot in oil and epoxy salt mix

YouTube - wind coming from wires pushes wood and paper

Comments anyone?

Love and light

[rave154]

INQ,

are you SURE youre not related to Tesla somehow !?!??!?

Dayummmmm fine experiments...

one thought, with regard to the lil bits of wood, could you repeat it..but have the bits of wood...away from any other wires etc....just so you would know that its not an intereaction between the HV..and....the wires ( of your circyut ) and the CFL......just isolate the HV and the wood.....and see if they move.

David. D

[Raui]

Inq,
Earlier this year I experimented with a flyback transformer powered by the ballast of a cfl. I was investigating what high voltage does to different materials. I checked out oil and got the same effect. Something neat is to get the negative and dip that into the oil then get an arc between the two. If I remember correctly it forms oil droplets which flow from the negative terminal over to the positive!

As usual great work!

- Raui

[Radiant_Science]

This is exactly what Tesla noticed with H.V. leads submerged in mineral oil...at first he thought it was "entrapped gasses" in the copper wire. However, it was too prolific to be entrapped gasses. This observation is what started his gaseous aether theory.

[sucahyo]

Maybe in air the HV attract air to the copper surface and thus creating pressure at the tip.

For oil bubble or gas, is it possible that oil being electrolized?

Is there any difference between wire without insulation and wire with insulation and only it's tip are exposed to air?

[thedude]

Fun with HV

Hi Inquorate. I've noticed very similar things. Currently i'm working on two different tesla coils. A large one using 3 MOTs in a parallel config (1 as an inductive balast) which i'm in the process of tuning and building a rotary spark gap. The other is much smaller using a 555 timer setup with ignition coils. I have a spark gap (two small pieces of welding rod) that when spaced properly , with just the right pulse and duty that is generating a nice colapsing field from a 10" tall little mini tesla coil that is positioned in series with my caps and spark gap.

In tuning my configuration i've seen fragments of copper wire laying on the table adjacent to the wires dance around. Just as you are observing, with a radiant discharge occuring due to the spark gap, some insulators and wire casings no longer work very well. I've had to put 3 layers of shrink wrap on a couple pots just to be able to touch them when i have a real violent (scratchy) spark gap tuned in. My issues are that even though i have 1n4001 diodes in place on my timer circuit, when tuned well (or not well for the 555 chip) I inevitably blow the timer. I think i need better diodes or better placement. on the circuit. I have HV diodes that i salvaged from a few microwaves on the neg from the gap to the ignition coils as well. Have been following most common recommendations for dioding but with pots on pins 2 ,7 and 3 i am finding really violent effects that ultimately cost me 555 chips. Have you had similar problems. Or are you even using a 555 timer (guess i assumed)?
I might try using a bedini self oscillating circuit with a darlington transistor config to bump up the amps to power the spark gap and see if that is more reliable.
Anyway. i don't have much to contribute here, just wanted to say hi and compare experiences. Probably make a couple videos to show what i end up with this weekend.
Cheers!

[CitizenDC]

Wind from ionizer

Hi Guys,

Long time.

I read this topic and I think its best I share my findings while its still fresh in my memory.

I assembled an electronic Ionizer kit recently.
To test it I decided to use the cave-man approach and try smell any ozone. What I noticed immediately was a jet of cool air that one can easily feel in that mustache area just above your lips.
The jet is preportional to the direction of the end of the wire.

If you can visualise a hose-pipe and water coming out of it in a straight line, if you turned the hose in any direction, the water flows only in that direction. Now the ionizer is doing the same thing but through the wire and it feels like cool air.

The next thing I noticed is that my bench psu began acting up as soon as I created arcs by bringing a piece of metal near ionizers the output wire. With each arc my bench psu would cut off with the sound of psu's relays tripping.

So thinking maybe this is feedback from the ionizer shooting back into the psu, I decided to instead power the ionizer from a small 7ah 12v battery.
Well that didnt keep my psu safe.
The arcs still affected my psu which I had left on.
The ionizer was about 30-40cm away from the psu btw.
So, after ignoring the psu's behavior and continuing making arcs I did a little damaged to my Psu. The amp meter reading which always read 0.01 amp now constantly read 0.02/3 amp under no load.
Each time the relays clicked the LCD would blank out and I guess somewhere along the lines the psu's calibration got screwed with.
I'd like to mention that I've run ignition coils driven by relays from this same psu without any problems and so I find it odd that an ionizer (12v 50ma) which is not connected to it can cause it problems.

Okay the next wierd thing.
So I leave my ionizer on at my work bench for the potential health benefits negative ions offer. I left one of my multimeters sitting just below the ionizer which was being held up with one of those helping-hands.
Anyways, I get back a little later and notice the LCD on the multimeter is almost completely black. I move the multimeter away and LCD begins clearing. I move it back and it blackens again. Not all of the LCD returned normal.
I really had to rub the LCD glass hard in order to get the stuck liquid crystal to release.

I'm beginning to realise that ionizer's are quite destructive to electronics. So now keep this little demon in a corner, far from anything it could possibly destroy.

Anyways, thought I'd share.

cheers

[Inquorate]

Hi dude

I've been blowing up 555 timers for as long as I've known about them.

This time, thanks to Ren, I've been using a different, REALLY simple circuit (but kinda dangerous?)

dualicpage

It's just a line voltage light dimmer (i got a 500w one with safeties etc), which cost me 60 bucks at a hardware store, then between 1 and 10uf 800 to 1000v of capacitance on the same wire. The more capacity, the more amps.

I initially had purchased a $200 isolation transformer as an extra safeguard, but blew the fuse when ren and I took out the aforementioned capacitors (to see if more current made his hairpin circuit work).

So long as the caps are there though, it works fine driving the ignition coils, without the isolation transformer; I've had it running for over 4 hours at a time without anything blowing up..

I recommend putting it in a box though, as there's live wires.

Since then, I've had a very reliable HV circuit

Look forward to seeing your videos.

@all - I've some experiments in mind to determine if ion wind is involved, and will do them soon.

// anyone know how I can rectify 60kv without finding more diodes? Mine are only rated at 25kv. I'm thinking magnets that support current flow one way across a spark, but not the other. Thus the spark will jump further one way. Make 2 of those, and it's a half wave bridge rectifier?

Love and light

[gyula]

Hi Folks,

I think this "wind issuing from ends of wires" has been studied by Thomas Townsend Brown and Agnew A. Bahnson, among others, mainly in the 60's.
A practical manifestation of this is the lifter, built also by Naudin. Because I do think that the "wind" you sense is thrust, "made" by the high voltage.

Here are some patents on electrical trust producing devices, collected from T. T. Brown memory site: Qualight Systems Design
Library section ( Library of Archives )
Library - Patents
US 3,187,206 GB 920,498 US 2,958,790 US 3,227,901 US 4,339,782

Here is an online book on T. T. Brown: Thomas Townsend Brown: Scientific Notebooks, Vol. 1

Good reading!

rgds, Gyula

[Shamus]

I don't know why, but there seems to be this perception that T. T. Brown's work was similar to Msr. Naudin and his ion-wind lifters. Mr. Brown's work is interesting because he apparently figured out a way to warp space itself: Warp drive is real, and T. T. Brown discovered it over 60 years ago!

Thanks for those links, BTW. Here's a relevant passage from the Qualight website:

The "Biefeld-Brown Effect," sometimes referred to as the "Townsend Brown Effect," is frequently erronously associated with ionic wind "lifters," most likely stemming from Townsend Brown's work with electrostatic speakers/fans/precipitators, which were designed to maximize the ionic (electrostatic) wind effect. The "thrust" created by lifters is due to the ionization of atmospheric gases, and the apparatuses are designed to maximize that effect. Two fundamental characteristics of the Biefeld-Brown Effect become clear to the studious observer:

1) It has been proven numerous times that lifters will not work in a vacuum, demonstrating that ionic wind is, in fact, responsible for the thrust generated, and thus, any force generated by the coupling of electromagnetic and gravitational force would represent the normal residual gravitational field associated with any electromagnetic effect. Townsend Brown conclusively demonstrated in France in the 1950's that his tri-arcuate discs performed more efficiently in a vacuum than at atmospheric pressure. Although the discoid apparatuses worked well in air, the associated ionic wind was considered wasted energy, and they were specifically designed to work most efficiently in a vacuum. At higher pressures associated with atmospheric pressures, significant ionic wind associated with the high voltages used in the discoid apparatuses was utilized to enhance the thrust. As the vacuum increased the discoid apparatuses utilized an effect called plasmahydrodynamics to enhance the thrust, until ultimately relying primarily on the Biefeld-Brown Effect as ultra-high vacuum pressures were obtained.

2) The pure Biefeld-Brown Effect does not incorporate an ionic wind component.

Here's another of those well-worth-reading links about T. T. Brown: Electric Flying Machines - Thomas Townsend Brown

[sucahyo]

// anyone know how I can rectify 60kv without finding more diodes? Mine are only rated at 25kv. I'm thinking magnets that support current flow one way across a spark, but not the other. Thus the spark will jump further one way. Make 2 of those, and it's a half wave bridge rectifier?

Try with only frequency and duty cycle combination if you plan to use spark gap.

[elias]

What a Synchronicity

Hi
Yesterday I tested the A4Tech anion keyboard, which claims to refresh the environment around your computer by releasing Anions.
A4Tech ANION Keyboard KAS 15M PS - RomaniaMall.ro cumpara, preturi, online

It had a breeze of cold ion wind, and it could be felt really strongly.

Elias

[gyula]

I don't know why, but there seems to be this perception that T. T. Brown's work was similar to Msr. Naudin and his ion-wind lifters. Mr. Brown's work is interesting because he apparently figured out a way to warp space itself: Warp drive is real, and T. T. Brown discovered it over 60 years ago!

Thanks for those links, BTW. Here's a relevant passage from the Qualight website:

Here's another of those well-worth-reading links about T. T. Brown: Electric Flying Machines - Thomas Townsend Brown

Hi Shamus,

Thanks for the correction/addition!

Gyula

[Inquorate]

Spark gap rectifier

I'm not going to start a new thread for this; I have too many threads / projects going right now..

YouTube - c30kv magnetic diode proof of concept

it seems possible to make a diode using a spark gap and magnets. In the video I have neo and ferrite magnets, but it does work with only ferrite ones.

Love and light

[Shamus]

@Inquorate: Hey, if it worked for Tesla...

Nice work, BTW, Inq.