This is it !

[Farmhand]

Yeah I had seen them but didn't take much notice. I'll keep studying it to see if I can understand it better. Your right the opto's are 8 pin. Yes I think i see what you mean about the grounding. Interesting, i'll have to see if I can find some better drawings of fet drivers using opto's.

Good points.

[Farmhand]

Hi all, Ok I think what we need first and foremost to be even able to get the very narrow pulses we have to have very straight side's to our gate pulse, like the picture below, if we can see the side's of the pulse on a anologue scope I don't think it will be quick enough.

http://koa0iw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pqCmzh419-Gl52rQsPTzGh5xDEShgnMeKI1J7D9pEcON7wzs_z8CFiP8bZ32x_aaltSYZvDRbfAsduZYUXAI06Bjc1zNvPnY5/DSBuild%20Driver%20002.JPG?psid=1

That pulse is not actually charging a gate, but you can see in the next picture, which I labeled up for the benifit of those who might not know quite what the trace represents (I hope i did it right, tell me if I didn't) anyway in this pic the trace can be seen indicating that the mosfet switching is slower than the hi to low and vice versa switching of the pulse generator, I think, anyway thats my theory. The trace can be seen to rise and fall. Maybe i'm just fussy.

http://koa0iw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p09Ib73_lGB8TrrcfHOiK0dNTUfsccRYfyRDLuY9_USdi7_gszRqwDbM9z7z-EWRXmn3Wk0baW1xul1tVwBjtUTX-FCKwS7AD/Labeled%20Scope%20Shot.jpg?psid=1

This shot is in two battery mode.

Gmeast, I'll try to get a shot of the distortion in the gate signal that I think is causing me problems, if you could tell me what you think is causing it. It might help me understand if it's the problem or not and how to fix it if it is. I'll edit it in here after.

Ok so I took shots of both devices the first one is driving a single IRF540 and the second one is driving two. I blew em right up to see them better. You can see the bright spots, not as bad as I thought, maybe the input capacitance of the fet is a factor aswell. Maybe the bright spots are the pulse hitting the diodes. Also the fall time seems reletively unaffected by driving two together, but the rise time is. There are no resistors on this setup. This type of driver works good but i think it has something to do with the twitching at higher frequencies, so i'm not happy till I work it out. Maybe resistors have a smoothing effect.

http://public.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pzjLIcJUlK1wgTMZ8ewdYnHwjN_TU7KdUFuDr87OjUaxNXdyR-6gfsukjQotv7lj_rJ3njL5zcKwW5HfkMOvFxA/Pulse%20shots%2001010.jpg?psid=1

http://public.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pBzlG8KQOHxe_0vLpKXEdhnJnV0dBedCV1jFIwyykIm15b9WPXP77_dG0DWwc4jxsNIcBhaT8-WhRknZUphhogg/Pulse%20shots%200088.jpg?psid=1

Cheers

Edit. Well I just tried three different coils and a transformer two different ways and the transformer bent the gate pulse all out of shape big time, it turned it into a triangle. The transformer has a laminated core. I can only come to the conclusion I need to get my wire and wind it on the core so I can just test with the big dohnut, the gate pulse does not seem to be bent out of shape when I use a low resistance, thick wire, iron powder cored coil.

It appears to me, if you guys were pulsing coils on iron powder core's your gate pulse would look different. Because mine does, it looks a lot different, but I don't know why it would affect the shape of the gate pulse, that doesn't make sense to me.. It could very well be that your pulses are OK.

[gmeast]

Irf540z

Oh my goodness, .................................................. .............................
.................................................. .................................................. .......
The IRF540Z's are automotive mosfets. Probably worth a pretty penny.
Rgrds

I just bought four from DigiKey for $1.70 ea U.S. Not as bad as I though they would be. I've used them before, just didn't remember the cost. I think they were actually more than that years ago ... when first I used them.

Later

[Farmhand]

Stan Meyers

Hi Guys, I have some important research, I will, post pics.

PGFE Chapter 10 P45 or Page 564 to 583 of the whole book.

Some snippets. Enjoy.

http://9xhe3g.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pBMXTC8zP2Z0fM1LJG1ErXcl8l0pz7Wn2pJhQykUBYXhx0uP3tn__znywfUjM_OABZJ0UIaD-_ClJBcexMcrHw70t_7vbFT4X/Stan%20Meyers.png?psid=1

http://9xhe3g.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pR-SlnY67d0CtseLSLkeE27ZqO17dzc-MM-1gM9D1DEStnj-LoeLQ-X8h4C93I-L5Q-_fKUwVal8k591IRk1YqJ__uY4_wuS4/Stan%20Meyers%202.jpg?psid=1

http://9xhe3g.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pJ2CDZuDcH2aIkg3jucH9TVvACAHEq77i8gToynEq3jbJa_uBG69CEkTZVrLu6LUVjm6rvxA84duoy7tNMz9ebnIV5sDvdz6Z/Stan%20Meyers%203.jpg?psid=1

You can see by that Y shaped coil drawing, when compared to the one from the Tesla document, it is tesla's concept I believe. It is interesting to note that Stan is dead and apparently he was poisoned.

Anyway he didn't use any fancy gate drivers, so you are spot on gmeast. He did however use a very interesting gating or grouping of the pulses into sets.

I'm not sure what to make of all this. I'm starting to get really angry about all these dead people. If they just told everybody it was Tesla's idea, he is already dead they can't kill him again. Make's me wonder .

Rgds

P.S. If anyone is concerned about the safety issue still being a problem, now would be a good time to think about your choices.

EDIT This is the drawing I was talking about I don't think it is coincidence myself, any reseacher worth thier salt would have seen this drawing. Of course I may be wrong but that is my opinion.

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p1mnovgB1YBvo9StrDyzRj2YMqAG05Xmt8gjX_np_xc5Xe_-r-VSdA6Ipl9Z9LlTBZuJKZaY4Kz5VZauSW3PaEVSpnJiLUhJB/Converter%20Generator.jpg?psid=1

Stan even did it with a motor and alternator, for cryin out loud, just like in the Tesla drawing. No toroid. It is the three coils that do the trick, or the interference maybe the Toroid just is much better. Oh I like his switch selector for cap value to control frequency. 555's oh my goodness.

[Farmhand]

Circuit

Ok it seems to me we can do this with three free running oscillators (as Gmeast mentioned way back) arranged as in the drawing a couple of pages back, it may need some changes of course but the circuit part is valid I think, free running or syncrhonised, pretty much just gotta hit em with some good sharp puses and experiment untill we hit on a repeatable formula.

I can see no reason why the free running oscillators could not be 555/556 based, CMOS4001/4011, or op-amps or whatever works. The 100 ohm resistors and capacitors on the supply to the oscillators is important for isolation but it is the isolation that counts not really how its done.

I believe a gate driver with a pnp transitor to take down the gate charge is the superior method to the plain two resistor method, opto's maybe better than both.

Cheers

P.S.

I have only begun to research this area recently, and have only been "into" this kind of stuff for a year or a bit more. Which make's me wonder.

1. Where is the support from the wider community ?
2. Do we really want to do this ?
3. Do people really want cheap energy ?
4. If there is so much energy tapping in these setups, why no hard proof yet ?
5. Who is gonna do the testing and verification of any apparent power gain ?
6. Will it be good enough to convince people ?
7. Will it change anything ?
8. Will this kind of thing ever be commercialised when there are no patents involved ?

No wonder the real experimenters get dissalusioned. ( and I don't mean me I am a total amature). Thats probably why I feel like I just got hit by a train, again.

[gmeast]

.................................................. .................................................. .......................
That pulse is not actually charging a gate, but you can see in the next picture, which I labeled up for the benifit of those who might not know quite what the trace represents (I hope i did it right, tell me if I didn't) anyway in this pic the trace can be seen indicating that the mosfet switching is slower than the hi to low and vice versa switching of the pulse generator, I think, anyway thats my theory. The trace can be seen to rise and fall. Maybe i'm just fussy.

http://koa0iw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p09Ib73_lGB8TrrcfHOiK0dNTUfsccRYfyRDLuY9_USdi7_gszRqwDbM9z7z-EWRXmn3Wk0baW1xul1tVwBjtUTX-FCKwS7AD/Labeled%20Scope%20Shot.jpg?psid=1

This shot is in two battery mode.
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................

OK, I'm confused.

I can see that you are at about 19.2% duty cycle ... correct?

What's your coil?

Are you using a recovery diode?

What is the ringing section immediately following the period you have labeled "Battery Charge period".?

And, please, what is "... two battery mode."?

Sorry if it suddenly appears as though I have turned into an idiot. I guess I'm just staying too focused on the simplest form of the target effort. That's why I have never hooked up any more than one battery in these circuits. I mean I've never built a Bingo, Stingo, etc.

Later

[Farmhand]

Hi Greg, No probs, Yes that duty is correct, thats because the shot i chose to label is from my normal desulfator in charging mode at high power but fairly low frequency I can easily change that by changing one capacitor from.01uf to .001uf. then I can adjust it down to a couple of percent.

The gate pulse in the first picture is wide but when it is connected to a gate it becomes much narrower just by connecting it.

The coil used when that shot was taken is a 90 wind coil in three layers on a 10mm iron powdercore (rod). Much like is described in the meyer replication in PGFE book but only single winding not bifiler.

Yes that shot is scoped on the annode of the recovery diode.

I just put a red square around that because I think it might cause some minor charging, but if the frequency is increased enough even at a narrow PW they are gobbled up as you know, and have seen. The actual trace shape differs from coil form geometry from what I can tell but only at certain frequencies.
I can get a scope shot very similar to the ones you have shown. I think it is the right form.

Two battery mode is to test the normal operation of the circuit and see the difference. I try to never pulse a coil without removing the spike. If I attempt to run my circuit at high power without removing the collapse it uses a lot of power and gets hot.

Two battery mode is charging battery negative to source battery positive, and recovery diode to charging positive, just like normal. Then when i use a choke I can see how much extra power it uses when disconnected.

I figure we should be able to just go from charging a separate second battery to self-charging just by adding the choke and connecting it to battery positive. After re-tuning to self charging parameters of course.

The length of that one wire from diode back to battery may be an important factor, aswell.

Cheers

Here is some scope shot's from my Stingo. If someone wants to try, three stingo's may well do a very respectable job, Stingo is a true free running blocking oscillator. It has NPN-PNP, a stingo made with very high performance componants would be a viable option in my opinion. Mine takes a lot of punishment and keeps working.

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pz1cw2NW6AiVg_G8nD7IZbW-kYl5h8iWUUF2zo7VAZ4lKVO3kDILkiHsA448be58NpuD5AzVVZm-7vP3pgN8zrRz2y1FqTVH8/Stingo_101%20002.JPG?psid=1

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pECSo6gLILLdybiLk7NnNFHLrR8RvKPJt7fR--KGwjBevGzskmFKn15E1phiX9Mjb9WtXw668Zt0Fla3Yjjco28rXuYQZs-N3/Stingo_101%20003.JPG?psid=1

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pR06InzjSygxJhRM8HPRBNr-QO6c6rII81WinCp_7atBSSU9g8bpMhDzs8BX8CfkiQH03O5M3lQRGwEBCy9HCtbm7eKmn7j5B/Stingo%20005.JPG?psid=1

[Farmhand]

This shot is wierd it looks like a digital letter "r". Thats secondary open, if I short the secondary the recovery waveform goes to very similar to normal single coil. Like the labeled shot.

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p6Qned8qD__aTvYfKZYxrLMzO2_iTaOH5Fd8SMapdnojtR6X0j5OIUys2WQMiseNoXuCpZaj_7CQgBUjCslok9wqpOP4_Hiqv/Pulse%20shots%20003sm.jpg?psid=1

Here's the capture of your's I refered to I get a shot similar to this pulsing a laminated core toroid 1.6 ohm winding. I notice 7imix got it too I think. And I think that is what can be expected from a steel core.

http://02d1852.netsolhost.com/radiant/charging/diode_no_saturation_wire_toroid_psmn4r3-30pl0.JPG

I'm starting to wonder if anyone will sell me the silver coated wire. I have one place left to try, it reopens in a few days. I'll keep looking for a local source though.

Cheers

[gmeast]

so far

This shot is wierd it looks like a digital letter "r". Thats secondary open, if I short the secondary the recovery waveform goes to very similar to normal single coil. Like the labeled shot.

http://kozpma.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p6Qned8qD__aTvYfKZYxrLMzO2_iTaOH5Fd8SMapdnojtR6X0j5OIUys2WQMiseNoXuCpZaj_7CQgBUjCslok9wqpOP4_Hiqv/Pulse%20shots%20003sm.jpg?psid=1

Here's the capture of your's I refered to I get a shot similar to this pulsing a laminated core toroid 1.6 ohm winding. I notice 7imix got it too I think. And I think that is what can be expected from a steel core.

http://02d1852.netsolhost.com/radiant/charging/diode_no_saturation_wire_toroid_psmn4r3-30pl0.JPG

I'm starting to wonder if anyone will sell me the silver coated wire. I have one place left to try, it reopens in a few days. I'll keep looking for a local source though.

Cheers

Right now I'm getting a 0.8usec pulse at 60kHz and the Mosfet is stone cold. In a few days Ill get a handfull of 2907's and 2222's plus some IRF540Z's. The I can try the rail-to-rail gate driver and see if anything improves. Can't wait for that. I guess I should get the 1-in. tape on its way so I can start winding my toroid.

Speaking of 'toroids', I don't think I've shown you guys the 'crappiest' toroid in the world ... everything is wrong:

http://02d1852.netsolhost.com/radiant/charging/steel_wire_core_toroid.jpg

You see the PW pot in the background, the Mosfet just right of the toroid, 2-11Ohm resistor voltage divider, right fork to ground and probe gnd, left fork to PWM pulse (pink wire and alligator) & common to gate (yellow wire and alligator) plus my scope channel 2.

I've never counted the turns, but it is about 3-1/2" dia. X 1/2 round cross section. The core is coiled 'steel' re-bar tie wire. The coil is insulated 22 ga. 'stranded' wire. I cant's really tell what its natural frequency is but it really fights me at close to 90kHz and I've lost two Fets up around there.

Well, There ya go,

Happy New Year (wonder when's the appropriate time to stop saying that?)

Later

[Farmhand]

Sweet Toroid

I love it, now the waveforms make sense. Is it full of steel? I wonder what air will do like 7imix said might be worth a try, and it was 7imix who first had the idea of using stingo too, he's sharp.

I am uploading a vid I have a bit of video ready to go nothing special, I thought i would post a link to this one in the new thread about transformers aswell.

I have that many pics and bit's of video, with my poor orginisation skills I can't find half of it. I'll try to stay calm, by listening to the rainbow song. It would be great if some others tried something with some stingo's, I might even try using my "volcano" sparkless spark gap. Sooner or later. Should be able to get freaky frequencies with that. Throw in a tesla serial connected bifilar pancake coil somewhere. Woohoo

It seems we will see what fate will bring us.

Cheers

Is it full of steel?

No need answer that now, ta.

[gmeast]

is it full of steel?

I love it, now the waveforms make sense.

Is it full of steel?

.............................................
.

As I said ... the core is some neatly coiled-up re-bar tie-wire. I bound it up with tape and wrapped on the crappy stranded wire.

I'll try an air core again, but as I recall, it tunes to about the same, as do the lam core trannys I've used.

Later

[sucahyo]

Yeah can almost take that with two fets but I need to regulate the voltage to the pulse generator to under 15 volts, and I have never used a voltage regulator, i've got one, fixed 12 volts, just haven't got around to it yet.

Why don't you use external power source or even the charged battery to power the pulse generator?

Or that is also not possible?


Thanks for stingo scope shot .

[Farmhand]

Why don't you use external power source or even the charged battery to power the pulse generator?

Or that is also not possible?


Thanks for stingo scope shot .

You have a very good point sucahyo, that is entirely possible, and a good idea, a small 12 volt battery would last for a very long time supplying 15- 30 Ma for the switching. I didn't think of that yet. I guess I do have a one track mind.

Thanks


Gmeast and all,

Difficult to explain my thoughts here, but I was thinking with a complicated fet driver arrangement the actual switch time is all that really matters, up to the point where the intrinsic delay time in the driver "switch train" before the switch event is caught up to and overlapped by the end of the previous switch event. In other words the delay time before the actual rise time of the Mosfet, must fit in the space or (dead time). The sharpness of the spike is produced by the switch time of the fet, the delay time in switching only affects the "free" "dead time".

Oh my, I assure you that does make sense, if you read it the right way.
.
I'll have another go, I'm not very good with words I just learned. It's only the ( rise-delay-fall ) time that is the spikemaker, even the delay time in the fet specs doesn't matter, it's not part of the actual switching time, rise to fall.

I think I put all the right words together that time. I confuse myself.

These things are everywhere.

http://www.energeticforum.com/99055-post421.html

Video link- YouTube - Small Toroid-2-1.wmv

[cikljamas]

1. Where is the support from the wider community ?

Watkjyky is scared by someones threats (real or no real i do not know but
if he lied it would be case for mental institution would not be ?), Stan is
obviously killed, Tesla died under strange circumstances (project
Philadelphia and Harp project ), Wilhelm Reich had same (huge) problems with governments prosecutor as Edwin Gray,Troy Reed is mystery too(his projects just disappeared, he took money i think and run away) Bob Boyce has some weird theory of scalar weapon that could have harm him...etc...etc...etc...I ask myself if we get REALLY close to some REAL solution what could happen to us too...
As long as these guys laugh on us seeing how far from REAL solution we
are we are safe, but in the case that we REALLY get somewhere i would
think twice before i say : come on guys there is nothing/no one that we have to be afraid of !!!

2. Do we really want to do this ?

No, we just waste our time waiting to die Sorry for this joke, you
know i do not mean anything mean (malice) !

3. Do people really want cheap energy ?

No, they want expensive energy !
Sorry for this joke too !

4. If there is so much energy tapping in these setups, why no hard proof yet ?

Either it is all fraud or these guys kept it for themselves and not because
they are selfish but because they are aware of what i wrote in question 1...

5. Who is gonna do the testing and verification of any apparent power gain ?

You and me and others from our team who want cheap energy !
No one else, or if they did they would not inform us about it !

6. Will it be good enough to convince people ?

The point is that you can build it for yourself but dont you dare to convince
people about such thing, and even if you convince them you will certainly
have not the chance to commercialise that !

7. Will it change anything ?

Of course not in the large scale, but for few people it could change things
a bit...unfortunately !!! But small bird in our hands is better than big bird
on the tree ! You see, we have to play like Kutuzov against Napoleon (from
the ambush), short, sudden, often attacks...

8. Will this kind of thing ever be commercialised when there are no patents involved ?

Never !
Why ?
Greed and selfishness !

Thats probably why I feel like I just got hit by a train, again.

I feel like that every day looking people as very strange kind of product
of evolution ! Btw, there is not such thing as evolution indeed, but evolution
is creation of evel mind with purpose to keep people in sick (slavery) state
of mind !!!

All this does not mean that i try to extinguish this thread (not at all) i just
give you some warns that we should keep in mind while we are marching
towards our goal, because when we get there we should be more careful,
it means that last steps everyone should make by himself ! If i was wrong
i would be the happiest man in the world, but if i am right ...
History should teach us something, why to make same mistakes all over
again ?
And there is some other solution too : Lets make this thing and suddenly
publish it where ever we could, as much we could, some people say this
is the best selfprotect method : publish it !!!, But the critical interval is
between the point where we are right now and that point of publishing !!!

So, i wish us good luck and happy new year (Gmeast, maybe we should
stop with it now, or why not ending all our posts with happy n.y., until
31,12,2011. ? )

Cheers !

[Farmhand]

Diode

Hi Gmeast, could you tell me what the purpose of the 1n5408 diode across the coil windings in you circuit drawing ? I don't understand i'm sure there must be a good reason but i've missed it.

Cheers

Wise words cikljamas, I am going to continue, i'm definately not hurting anyone and never will. I had a feeling in the begining it could seem to get strange. When Sucahyo first mentioned "the TPU'ists" back near the begining of the thread I thought he was talking about an exotic cult or something. I was ready for wierdness, but once I realised he was just talking about people who made TPU's I felt much better. Thats perfectly normal.

The more I look the more people I see doing similar things, it's great. Just sometimes, I get sad when I research and read what happens to people, then angry, then confused wondering what is real and what is disinfo and what is imagined or induced. It's very hard to know, I like to think we are all on the same side, we just all have different circumstances and points of view, as far as what is the right thing to do and such. Probably with the internet the way it is, this is different now than then, better or worse I don't know. Hopefully better.